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religiousrealist

Table Of Contents

About this blog (contains links to various religious organizations): https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/about/

This is a listing by subject area:

Bible Worthiness: https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/08/12/bible-worthiness/

The Current World Situation: https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/10/17/current-world-situation/

Christianity:

  1. The church of Christ: https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/06/21/the-church-of-christ/
  2. Acts 20:28: https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/06/23/acts-2028/
  3. What is a true Christian? https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/06/23/what-is-a-true-christian/

Divine Beings:

  1. The Name of God: https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/06/23/the-name-of-god/
  2. The Divinity of Jesus: https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/08/12/the-divinity-of-jesus/
  3. John 1:1: https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/06/23/john-11-the-glue/
  4. Michael the Archangel: https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/06/29/michael-the-archangel/

Salvation:

  1. What Must I Do To Be Saved?: https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/07/22/what-must-i-do-to-be-saved/
  2. Guaranteed Salvation/Guaranteed Doom: https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2017/01/05/guaranteed-salvation-and-doom/
  3. The Rude Awakening: https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/10/31/the-rude-awakening/
  4. The Salvation Timeline: ‘
    1. Part 1: https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/06/20/first-blog-post/
    2. Part 2: https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/07/06/the-salvation-timeline-part-2/
    3. The 1000 year period: https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/06/23/the-1000-year-period/
  5. The Chosen:
    1. The 144,000: https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2017/01/05/the-144-thousand-and-the-angel-from-the-east/
    2. Purity: https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/10/03/purity/
  6. The “Rapture” https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2017/01/15/pre-trib-or-post-trib-rapture/
  7. The Seven  Seals of Revelation: https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2017/01/12/the-seven-seals-of-revelation/
  8. The End Times Prophecy (Daniel 7 and 12) https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2017/06/08/end-times-prophecy/
  9. Selling one’s soul https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2017/07/20/can-one-really-sell-hisher-soul/

Doom:

  1. “Hell”: https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/07/08/hell-hades-abyss-etc/
  2. The Mark Of The Beast: https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/06/20/the-mark-of-the-beast/
  3. The Lake Of Fire: https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/06/20/the-lake-of-fire/
  4. Immortal Soul/Eternal Torment: https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/06/23/immortal-souleternal-torment/
  5. Did Jesus really spend 3 days in Hades? https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2017/04/23/the-period-between-jesus-death-and-resurrection/

Conclusion: https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/12/21/conclusion/

Featured post

The Salvation Timeline

 

The Jehovah’s Witnesses believe that all except their religion will be destroyed at “Armageddon” and there will be a “Paradise Earth”.  They believe that only 144,000 will go to heaven and the remaining 8.2 million will live forever on earth. They also believe the previously dead of their religion will be resurrected just after “Armageddon”.  The “2nd death” is ceasing to exist.

Biblical Unitarians (www.stfonline.org; Christian Churches of God http://www.ccg.org is not covered because of the complexity of its teachings)  believe the chosen will be part of a pre-Tribulation rapture and those that survive the Great Tribulation will be risen to heaven just before Jesus’ 2nd coming. The remainder that survive “Armageddon” will live on a “Paradise Earth” but eternal life does not occur until AFTER the final judgment. Pre Trib rapture is even a bone of contention among some mainstream religions. They believe that the 2nd death is ceasing to exist.

7th Day Adventists believe as so “The millennium is the thousand-year reign of Christ with His saints in heaven between the first and second resurrections. During this time the wicked dead will be judged; the earth will be utterly desolate, without living human inhabitants, but occupied by Satan and his angels. At its close, Christ with His saints and the Holy City will descend from heaven to earth. The unrighteous dead will then be resurrected, and with Satan and his angels will surround the city; but fire from God will consume them and cleanse the earth. The universe will thus be freed of sin and sinners forever. (Rev. 20; 1 Cor. 6:2, 3; Jer. 4:23-26; Rev. 21:1-5; Mal. 4:1; Eze. 28:18, 19.)” (source: 7th Day Adventist website). This would indicate that the 2nd death is cessation to exist.

There are some religious groups that believe the 2nd resurrection occurs in a similar manner as what the 7th Day Adventists teach, except that group suffers eternal torment in the lake of fire.

Armstrongism (United Church of God http://www.ucg.org,  Restored Church of God http://www.rcg.org)  believe in a 2nd resurrection that occurs after the Wrath of God for people to redeem themselves during the 1000 years (a time of peace and prosperity) and a third resurrection of the wicked (quite possibly Rev 20:13). They also believe the 2nd death is ceasing to exist.

Hard core Catholics believe that the dead either go straight to hell, straight to heaven or “purgatory” (a middle ground for those not bad enough for hell nor good enough for heaven). Upon reading some Catholic websites, “Purgatory” is, in fact, Hades and “hell” is Gehenna (or the lake of fire).  Luke 16:19-31 is the story of the rich man who died and described a burning in Hades.

Most mainstream believe that those not the chosen ones will stand in front of the throne as outlined in Rev 20:12-15.  Each person will be reviewed and either sent to the lake of fire or heaven.

So let’s start at the basic verse (the first resurrection):

1 Thessalonians 4:16-17King James Version (KJV)

16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

The dead in Christ include:

The 144,000:

Revelation 7:2-4King James Version (KJV)

And I saw another angel ascending from the east, having the seal of the living God: and he cried with a loud voice to the four angels, to whom it was given to hurt the earth and the sea, Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads. And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel. 

If one reads Rev 14, the 144,000 are without fault and blameless.  The fall of Babylon occurs after the 144K in Verse 8. Also, those who worship the beast and have the mark of the beast on the hand and forehead are basically sent to the lake of fire.

Revelation 14:8-11King James Version (KJV)

And there followed another angel, saying, Babylon is fallen, is fallen, that great city, because she made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication. And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand, 10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb: 11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.

Those beheaded in the name of Jesus:

Revelation 20:4-5King James Version (KJV)

And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years. But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

Given the Holy City is still in heaven, they rule from heaven.

So what is the mark of the beast? It may surprise you.  https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/06/20/the-mark-of-the-beast/

The survivors of the Great Tribulation are the “alive in Christ”

Revelation 7:14King James Version (KJV)

14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

I think most Christians can agree the first resurrection is the chosen ones or “anointed class.”

Revelation 20:6King James Version (KJV)

Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Some believe that those consumed by fire in Rev 20:8-9 are the descendents of those that survived the Wrath of God in 2 Peter 3:7.

Revelation 20:7-10 King James Version (KJV)

And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea. And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them. 10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

Here is the final resurrection:

Revelation 20:12-15King James Version (KJV)

12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. 13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. 14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire. 

So if the earth is cleansed of sin in Rev 20:8-9, who is resurrected in verse 13 to stand in front of the throne? Let’s assume that Rev 20 occurs in a chronological manner. Rev 20:12 says the dead, small and great stand before God.  If all in the 2nd resurrection are consumed by fire in Rev 20:8-9 as some teach, who is left in verse 12?  Also, does that mean the “sea” and “Hades” are empty in verse 13? This and other details will be covered in “The 1000 Year Period.”

So does that mean some that stand in front of the throne will be saved?

Romans 2:14-16King James Version (KJV)

14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves: 15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;) 16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.

Revelation 21:27New International Version (NIV)

27 Nothing impure will ever enter it, nor will anyone who does what is shameful or deceitful, but only those whose names are written in the Lamb’s book of life (the Holy City is described in verses 1-4; It comes down out of heaven.Lastly, the time line of 2 Peter 3:7-13

2 Peter 3:7-13New International Version (NIV) –

By the same word the present heavens and earth are reserved for fire, being kept for the day of judgment and destruction of the ungodly. But do not forget this one thing, dear friends: With the Lord a day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years are like a day. The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. Instead he is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance. 10 But the day of the Lord will come like a thief. The heavens will disappear with a roar; the elements will be destroyed by fire, and the earth and everything done in it will be laid bare.[a] 11 Since everything will be destroyed in this way, what kind of people ought you to be? You ought to live holy and godly lives 12 as you look forward to the day of God and speed its coming.[b] That day will bring about the destruction of the heavens by fire, and the elements will melt in the heat. 13 But in keeping with his promise we are looking forward to a new heaven and a new earth, where righteousness dwells.

Revelation 5:9-10King James Version (KJV)

And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

The above would indicate that those in the first resurrection would rule on the earth AFTER the final judgment.

Here is the scenario:

Biblically we know that the Wrath of God happens at the 2nd coming of Jesus, governments are destroyed as are earthly organizations (including Babylon and the false prophets) and the wicked (including those that have the mark of the beast).  That is something that probably just about all Christian professing religions can agree on.  There is no evil during the 1000 years and that is another thing agreed on.  I think most of Christianity believes that the earth at the 2nd coming will be a wasteland.

At that point, those that died both before God’s Wrath and during would know nothing.

Ecclesiastes 9:5New International Version (NIV)

For the living know that they will die,
    but the dead know nothing;
they have no further reward,
    and even their name is forgotten.

What about those that MAY survive God’s Wrath?  What if  the earth left was not, in fact a paradise?  What if some thought they were part of the chosen ones but here they are?  So who would be those consumed by fire in Rev 20:8-9 and who would be those that stand in front of the throne in Rev 20:12-15? Is it possible the 2nd resurrection could occur in 2 parts?

Here is a link to the “The 1000 Year Period” https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/06/23/the-1000-year-period/

Now we get to the group in Rev 20:12-15.  Matt 25:31-41 goes with this where Jesus separates the goats from the sheep.

Matthew 25:31-41King James Version (KJV)

31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory: 32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats: 33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left. 34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: 35 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in: 36 Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me. 37 Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink? 38 When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee? 39 Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee? 40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me. 41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yo3quMMp24U a classic Jack Chick tract.  Mainstream seems to follow this line.

The ones that would be in for a rude awakening at this point would be their impression that they were in the group of the chosen or the ones that thought they were really doing the work of the Lord.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PO8pB5P6EzY Flight 144 is a prime example.

What is the lake of fire? https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/06/20/the-lake-of-fire/

For a continuation and some thoughts, follow this link:  https://wordpress.com/post/religiousrealist.wordpress.com/719  (The Salvation Timeline Part 2)

The parting thought:

Matthew 5:8 New King James Version (NKJV)

Blessed are the pure in heart,
    For they shall see God

What is purity? https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/10/03/purity/

 

Featured post

Can One Really Sell His/Her Soul

It has been stated that people sell their souls to Satan in exchange for fame and fortune.

https://www.gotquestions.org/sell-soul-devil.html – but can you really “sell your soul to Satan” and is it irrevocable? For that matter, is the “mark of the beast” also irrevocable?  Biblically not, according to the above article.

According to this young man (who is evidently a 7th Day Adventist), no.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deal_with_the_Devil

We do have a choice of following good or evil. Or at least we start out that way.  But where does it deviate?

Truthfully, this can be extended to religious organizations.  Two cases:

  1. A member has some sort of fault or misdeed known by the leadership.  The RIGHT way is for the person to be given a chance to come clean or face the consequences; in other words, correct the error.  The wrong way is to coerce the person to do something sinful in exchange for keeping the fault quiet; example would be to defame former members of the religion (even to the point of lying), or be turned in to the authorities and possibly be publicly humiliated (in other words “do this or we will expose you”).
  2. The organization (or a member) has a fault or misdeed that is known to some.  If someone  accepts a bribe to bear false witness or cause harm then it would be classified as “selling one’s soul to Satan.”

Matthew 5:43-48New International Version (NIV)

43 “You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor[a] and hate your enemy.’ 44 But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, 45 that you may be children of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. 46 If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? 47 And if you greet only your own people, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that? 48 Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect.

Romans 12:21New International Version (NIV)

21 Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.

1 Peter 3:8-10New International Version (NIV)

Finally, all of you, be like-minded, be sympathetic, love one another, be compassionate and humble. Do not repay evil with evil or insult with insult. On the contrary, repay evil with blessing, because to this you were called so that you may inherit a blessing.

Colossians 3:8New International Version (NIV)

But now you must also rid yourselves of all such things as these: anger, rage, malice, slander, and filthy language from your lips.

With all these in mind, we have the choice of doing what is right or wrong.  God gives you the ability to critically think and you have a conscience.

There are some pretty horrifying things that those who supposedly “sell themselves to Satan” have to do. Street gang initiations are classified among this.

  1. Sodomy being forced on people of either sex.
  2. Being forced to eat feces.
  3. Participating in Satanic rituals that involve animal or human sacrifice.
  4. Doing vandalism or arson.
  5. Committing murder.
  6. Being forced to harm themselves.
  7. Engaging in bestiality.
  8. Engaging in acts of violence.

Initiations are one thing and should be in good taste.  The military and colleges have rites of passage.  So do certain societies.  Even sports teams have some sort of initiation. They are done with a purpose in mind.

  1. Eating disgusting food such as “truth serum.”
  2. Doing foolish things or harmless pranks (such as singing a school fight song at 3 AM).
  3. Being forced to take a spanking on the buttocks.
  4. Physical endurance tests.
  5. In the military, basic training, Special Forces (SEALS, Rangers, Delta Force) are meant to test the physical limits and mental limits of their personnel.

So, getting back to “selling your soul to Satan”…………. What is “soul?”

noun

1. the spirit or immaterial part of man, the seat of human personality, intellect, will, and emotions, regarded as an entity that survives the body after death. related adjective: pneumatic.

2.  (Christianity) the spiritual part of a person, capable of redemption from the power of sin through divine grace.

3.  the essential part or fundamental nature of anything.

4.  a person’s feelings or moral nature as distinct from other faculties.

5. Also called soul music.  a type of Black music resulting from the addition of jazz, gospel, and pop elements to the urban blues style. (as modifier): a soul singer

6. (modifier ) of or relating to Black Americans and their culture: soul brother, soul food

7.  nobility of spirit or temperament: a man of great soul and courage

8. an inspiring spirit or leading figure, as of a cause or movement

9. a person regarded as typifying some characteristic or quality:

the soul of discretion

10.  a person; individual: an honest soul

11. the life and soul

12. upon my soul!, an exclamation of surprise

Conscience:

noun

1. the inner sense of what is right or wrong in one’s conduct or motives, impelling one toward right action: to follow the dictates of conscience.

2.  the complex of ethical and moral principles that controls or inhibits the actions or thoughts of an individual.

3.  an inhibiting sense of what is prudent: I’d eat another piece of pie but my conscience would bother me.

4. conscientiousness

5. Obsolete.  consciousness; self-knowledge.

6. Obsolete.  strict and reverential observance.

Biblically, based on 1 Thess 5:23, we have 3 parts: body, spirit  and soul.  Upon death, the spirit returns to God, the body to dust (Eccl 12:7) and the soul clings to dust (Ps 119:25).

 

For all practical purposes, the “soul” is our mind.  Read the below verses.

Ezekiel 18:20King James Version (KJV)20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.

Hebrews 9:27King James Version (KJV)

27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

Does your physical body actually sin? Or is your mind commanding its  actions the one that sins?  Sometimes we THINK about doing something wrong but do we carry it out?  Do demons or angels possess our minds to the point where they control it?

The frontal lobes of one’s brain controls the emotions.  Let’s say we see someone in a supermarket line that has a rather attractive feature.  Arousal (or lack thereof) would be involuntary.  What causes one not to go up to the person and not rip his or her clothes off and attempt sexual relations?

What is it that causes a person to be a moron or a genius? What causes someone to be born mentally retarded, with Asperger’s Syndrome or autism?

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/kc/serotonin-facts-232248 -it is said that Serotonin controls a number of bodily functions, including thought process.  Lack of it is a sign of depression.  Certain hallucinogenic drugs such as LSD (C20H25N30 chemical) cause a marked increase in serotonin levels, causing hallucinations.

http://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/bipolar-disorder/symptoms-causes/dxc-20307970   Bipolar disorder is caused by a chemical imbalance and generally the treatment is either Risperidone or Lithium.

http://www.symptomsfind.com/symptoms.php?ds=1439 – an example of a disorder of not knowing right vs wrong.
Hypothyroidism aggravates depression.
It has been said that people who are gay, lesbian, bisexual or transgender are born that way.  There are some heterosexuals who have these kind of thoughts but do not act them out. Likewise, what is the difference between a promiscuous person and one that is monogamous?
Many of the above factors can contribute to “selling one’s soul to Satan.”  Bottom line is it is all mental.  Watch the below videos.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oJAwBk2aBds  About a Christian band that hits the big time.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=joEpBENeGW0&t=182s   About 4 brothers where one becomes a big name preacher and another a humble pastor at a homeless shelter.
What about cults like Jim Jones, Scientology and some religions?
 So what motivates people to supposedly “sell their souls?”:
1. Need (food, shelter, clothing, friendship)
2.  Wants (material things, the desire to be “saved” in the case of religion, notoriety).
3.  Survival.
4. Lack of hope (for instance, the belief that suicide is the only solution or they believe they are not in control of their situation).
5.  Fear (leaving the situation could supposedly be detrimental).
6.  Rewards (money, apparent “salvation”).
The ones leading these people use the following:
1. Promises of prosperity or salvation.
2.  Mental control (a prime example would be an elephant being retained by a small rope).
a. Fear (for instance, if you don’t do what they tell you, you will die or not be saved, or they will damage your reputation)
b. Reinforcement/deprivation (material things, pleasure – physical or emotional, association of negative things with not doing what they want – such as electric shock for certain behaviors).
c. Use of drugs or alcohol (one can’t think clearly under influence).  Some celebrities have addiction.
d. Getting one to think those outside the organization are undesirable (and even in entertainment, the powers that be select who their subordinates date or marry).
So how does one break out of the control?
1. Some event causes this person to think rationally.  This could be the loss of a loved one, a rash of personal financial issues,  or exposure of anomalies within an organization.
2. Intervention by an outside source.  The same logic can be used to help someone combat substance abuse.
So what is a controlling factor that would keep the person in the situation? (besides reasons 1-6 under “motivation”)
1. Cognitive dissonance – the belief that the truth is a lie and vice versa or ignoring “black and white facts.”
2. Level of intelligence.
3.  Mental state (such as depression).
4.  Substance abuse or brain damage caused by it.
5. Concern about what others think.
Sometimes fanatics within the organization will coerce or even kill the individual.  The other side effect is a person renews his or her life.
Is there any truth to a so-called “Illuminati hit,” where someone meets an untimely natural death (by heart attack, for instance)?  Satan does not control when we die.  He may influence a violent death and God may let it happen because it is “one’s time.”
“Selling one’s soul” even involves suicide. If you kill yourself, Satan has won the battle.
What about a “near death experience,” drug-induced hallucination where someone supposedly hears the voice of God, or a dream where someone visits the lake of fire or heaven?  These things, although in the mind, are so profound that someone makes a life change.  They can’t be ignored.
One can’t ignore signs, because God DOES send them as a reminder for us to straighten our lives out (and NDEs or something encountered in a hallucination or dream).
Here is a passage related to “selling one’s soul” and it shows that a so-called “contract” can be reversed.

Isaiah 28:15-18King James Version (KJV)15 Because ye have said, We have made a covenant with death, and with hell are we at agreement; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, it shall not come unto us: for we have made lies our refuge, and under falsehood have we hid ourselves: 16 Therefore thus saith the Lord God, Behold, I lay in Zion for a foundation a stone, a tried stone, a precious corner stone, a sure foundation: he that believeth shall not make haste. 17 Judgment also will I lay to the line, and righteousness to the plummet: and the hail shall sweep away the refuge of lies, and the waters shall overflow the hiding place. 18 And your covenant with death shall be disannulled, and your agreement with hell shall not stand; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, then ye shall be trodden down by it.

 

End Times Prophecy

In this post we will attempt to analyze Daniel 7 and 12

Daniel 7King James Version (KJV)

In the first year of Belshazzar king of Babylon Daniel had a dream and visions of his head upon his bed: then he wrote the dream, and told the sum of the matters. Daniel spake and said, I saw in my vision by night, and, behold, the four winds of the heaven strove upon the great sea. And four great beasts came up from the sea, diverse one from another. The first was like a lion, and had eagle’s wings: I beheld till the wings thereof were plucked, and it was lifted up from the earth, and made stand upon the feet as a man, and a man’s heart was given to it. And behold another beast, a second, like to a bear, and it raised up itself on one side, and it had three ribs in the mouth of it between the teeth of it: and they said thus unto it, Arise, devour much flesh. After this I beheld, and lo another, like a leopard, which had upon the back of it four wings of a fowl; the beast had also four heads; and dominion was given to it. After this I saw in the night visions, and behold a fourth beast, dreadful and terrible, and strong exceedingly; and it had great iron teeth: it devoured and brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with the feet of it: and it was diverse from all the beasts that were before it; and it had ten horns. I considered the horns, and, behold, there came up among them another little horn, before whom there were three of the first horns plucked up by the roots: and, behold, in this horn were eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things. I beheld till the thrones were cast down, and the Ancient of days did sit, whose garment was white as snow, and the hair of his head like the pure wool: his throne was like the fiery flame, and his wheels as burning fire. 10 A fiery stream issued and came forth from before him: thousand thousands ministered unto him, and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him: the judgment was set, and the books were opened. 11 I beheld then because of the voice of the great words which the horn spake: I beheld even till the beast was slain, and his body destroyed, and given to the burning flame. 12 As concerning the rest of the beasts, they had their dominion taken away: yet their lives were prolonged for a season and time. 13 I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him. 14 And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed. 15 I Daniel was grieved in my spirit in the midst of my body, and the visions of my head troubled me.  16 I came near unto one of them that stood by, and asked him the truth of all this. So he told me, and made me know the interpretation of the things. 17 These great beasts, which are four, are four kings, which shall arise out of the earth. 18 But the saints of the most High shall take the kingdom, and possess the kingdom for ever, even for ever and ever. 19 Then I would know the truth of the fourth beast, which was diverse from all the others, exceeding dreadful, whose teeth were of iron, and his nails of brass; which devoured, brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with his feet; 20 And of the ten horns that were in his head, and of the other which came up, and before whom three fell; even of that horn that had eyes, and a mouth that spake very great things, whose look was more stout than his fellows. 21 I beheld, and the same horn made war with the saints, and prevailed against them; 22 Until the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the saints of the most High; and the time came that the saints possessed the kingdom. 23 Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth, which shall be diverse from all kingdoms, and shall devour the whole earth, and shall tread it down, and break it in pieces. 24 And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise: and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings. 25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time. 26 But the judgment shall sit, and they shall take away his dominion, to consume and to destroy it unto the end. 27 And the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom under the whole heaven, shall be given to the people of the saints of the most High, whose kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, and all dominions shall serve and obey him. 28 Hitherto is the end of the matter. As for me Daniel, my cogitations much troubled me, and my countenance changed in me: but I kept the matter in my heart.

Daniel 7 relates to the Seven Seals of Revelation and the four beasts and Judgment Day.

https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2017/01/12/the-seven-seals-of-revelation/

From that study, it was determined the second beast is quite possibly the UN and the Federal Reserve.  The rise and fall of communism (the Bear) was 1918-1949 and the US and USSR were major super powers during that time.

Numerous articles seem to concur that the third beast is Greece.  Also, it is possible that this gives rise to the Catholic Church,  given that the third beast in Rev 6 is a man (the Pope).

Verse 10 would seem to indicate only 100 million of the earth’s population would make it to the white throne judgment.  There are 1.2 billion Catholics in the world and the mark of the beast (Rev 13:16-17) is fulfilled by the sign of the cross (placing of the right hand of the forehead); furthermore, there are others will accept a mark of the beast in a different form just to survive (and this could include wearing of certain symbology).  Lastly, don’t forget those who sold their souls to Satan for fame and fortune.

The fourth beast in Verse 23 coincides with the beast in Rev 13.  The below article seems to concur it is Rome.  Also it coincides with Rev 6:7 and the opening of the fourth seal.  The “one world government” and “one world religion,” along with the mark of the beast all fit into this.  Please read the below:

http://www.decodingdaniel.com/daniel7/fourthbeast.html

https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/10/17/current-world-situation/ the stage is set.

Daniel 12King James Version (KJV)  –

12 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book. And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever. But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased. Then I Daniel looked, and, behold, there stood other two, the one on this side of the bank of the river, and the other on that side of the bank of the river. And one said to the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, How long shall it be to the end of these wonders? And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished. And I heard, but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what shall be the end of these things? And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end. 10 Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand. 11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days. 12 Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days. 13 But go thou thy way till the end be: for thou shalt rest, and stand in thy lot at the end of the days.

Daniel 12 is the end times and doesn’t appear to be chronological. Verses 1 and 2 are the resurrection of both the wicked and the righteous; however it doesn’t specify first or second.  Verse 10 would possibly apply to the millennium because that is the last chance for people to come to God at a time when there is no evil. Verse 11 through the end is the 3.5 years of the Great Tribulation (the last half of the 7 year period). It was also mentioned in “The Seven Seals of Revelation” article.

Job 21:30King James Version (KJV)

30 That the wicked is reserved to the day of destruction? they shall be brought forth to the day of wrath.

Could the two witnesses do their preaching during the 3.5 year period of the Great Tribulation only to be killed two months beforehand? Possibly…..  Who are they?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two_witnesses this might be a worthy article to explore.

Revelation 11:3-7New International Version (NIV)

And I will appoint my two witnesses, and they will prophesy for 1,260 days, clothed in sackcloth.” They are “the two olive trees” and the two lampstands, and “they stand before the Lord of the earth.”[a] If anyone tries to harm them, fire comes from their mouths and devours their enemies. This is how anyone who wants to harm them must die. They have power to shut up the heavens so that it will not rain during the time they are prophesying; and they have power to turn the waters into blood and to strike the earth with every kind of plague as often as they want. Now when they have finished their testimony, the beast that comes up from the Abyss will attack them, and overpower and kill them.

Daniel 7:13-14 and Daniel 12:12-13 could both tie together as the 2nd coming of Jesus.

 

 

Again, this is live and will update.

 

The Period Between Jesus’ Death and Resurrection

There are some that claim that Jesus spent 3 days in “hell” before being resurrected. Previous posts determined that the common grave of mankind is called “Sheol” in the Old Testament and “Hades” in the New Testament. It would be better to use ASV or NIV in the analysis.  KJV has 54 instances of “hell” and Douay 113; consequently making the definition vague.

Setup of the equation:

1 Thessalonians 5:23King James Version (KJV)

23 And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

When we die:

Ecclesiastes 12:7King James Version (KJV)

Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.

Psalm 119:25King James Version (KJV)

25 My soul cleaveth unto the dust: quicken thou me according to thy word.

The events around Jesus’ death:

Luke 23:40-43King James Version (KJV)

40 But the other answering rebuked him, saying, Dost not thou fear God, seeing thou art in the same condemnation? 41 And we indeed justly; for we receive the due reward of our deeds: but this man hath done nothing amiss. 42 And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom. 43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, Today shalt thou be with me in paradise.

Matthew 27:46-50King James Version (KJV)

46 And about the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani? that is to say, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me? 47 Some of them that stood there, when they heard that, said, This man calleth for Elias. 48 And straightway one of them ran, and took a spunge, and filled it with vinegar, and put it on a reed, and gave him to drink. 49 The rest said, Let be, let us see whether Elias will come to save him. 50 Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost.

The events around His resurrection (abbreviated but please read the entire chapters):

John 20:27-29King James Version (KJV)

27 Then saith he to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing. 28 And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God. 29 Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.

Luke 24:36-39King James Version (KJV)

36 And as they thus spake, Jesus himself stood in the midst of them, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you. 37 But they were terrified and affrighted, and supposed that they had seen a spirit. 38 And he said unto them, Why are ye troubled? and why do thoughts arise in your hearts? 39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.

Luke 24:51King James Version (KJV)

51 And it came to pass, while he blessed them, he was parted from them, and carried up into heaven.

Transformation to a glorious body:

1 Corinthians 15:50-54King James Version (KJV)

50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption. 51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, 52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. 53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. 54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

Philippians 3:20-21King James Version (KJV)

20 For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ: 21 Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.

Where we go when we inherit eternal life:

Revelation 21:1-4King James Version (KJV)

21 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea. And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God. And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

Revelation 20:4King James Version (KJV)

And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

So what happens in Hades?:

Luke 16:22-24American Standard Version (ASV)

22 And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and that he was carried away by the angels into Abraham’s bosom: and the rich man also died, and was buried. 23 And in Hades he lifted up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. 24 And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am in anguish in this flame.

Yet the below states the dead know nothing:

Ecclesiastes 9:5-6King James Version (KJV)

For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten. Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished; neither have they any more a portion for ever in any thing that is done under the sun.

Jesus doesn’t know the hour of His coming:

Matthew 24:36King James Version (KJV)

36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.

These articles concern whether or not Jesus went down to Hades for 3 days or not.

http://www.endtime-prophets.com/spirdeath.html this article specifically addresses Matt 12:40

https://www.compellingtruth.org/did-Jesus-go-to-hell.html this article disputes it.

http://www.al.com/living/index.ssf/2017/04/did_jesus_descend_into_hell_be.html this appears to be in favor.

Some claim that Jesus spent 3 days in ‘hell” or “Hades” based on the below verse:

Acts 2:30-31American Standard Version (ASV)

30 Being therefore a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him, that of the fruit of his loins [a]he would set one upon his throne; 31 he foreseeing this spake of the resurrection of the Christ, that neither was he left unto Hades, nor did his flesh see corruption.

Acts 2:30-31King James Version (KJV)

30 Therefore being a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him, that of the fruit of his loins, according to the flesh, he would raise up Christ to sit on his throne; 31 He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ, that his soul was not left in hell, neither his flesh did see corruption.

ASV is a better translation.

Did He REALLY spend 3 days in Hades before resurrection?

David said the same thing about himself:

Acts 2:25-27American Standard Version (ASV)

25 For David saith concerning him,

[a]I beheld the Lord always before my face;
For he is on my right hand, that I should not be moved:
26 Therefore my heart was glad, and my tongue rejoiced;
Moreover my flesh also shall [b]dwell in hope:
27 Because thou wilt not leave my soul unto Hades,
Neither wilt thou give thy Holy One to see corruption.

Acts 2:29American Standard Version (ASV)

29 Brethren, I may say unto you freely of the patriarch David, that he both died and was buried, and his tomb is with us unto this day.

It can be deduced that it is David who is being spoke about in Acts 2:30-31.

2:25-31New International Version (NIV)

25 David said about him:

“‘I saw the Lord always before me.
    Because he is at my right hand,
    I will not be shaken.
26 Therefore my heart is glad and my tongue rejoices;
    my body also will rest in hope,
27 because you will not abandon me to the realm of the dead,
    you will not let your holy one see decay.
28 You have made known to me the paths of life;
    you will fill me with joy in your presence.’[a]

29 “Fellow Israelites, I can tell you confidently that the patriarch David died and was buried, and his tomb is here to this day. 30 But he was a prophet and knew that God had promised him on oath that he would place one of his descendants on his throne. 31 Seeing what was to come, he spoke of the resurrection of the Messiah, that he was not abandoned to the realm of the dead, nor did his body see decay.

It depends on how you read the above passage in NIV…..

KJV rendition would not be appropriate.

Other verses in NT used for that claim:

Matthew 12:40American Standard Version (ASV)

40 for as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the [a]whale; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

Ephesians 4:7-9American Standard Version (ASV)

But unto each one of us was the grace given according to the measure of the gift of Christ. Wherefore he saith, [a]When he ascended on high, he led captivity captive,
And gave gifts unto men. (Now this, He ascended, what is it but that he also descended [b]into the lower parts of the earth?

1 Peter 3:18-20New International Version (NIV)

18 For Christ also suffered once for sins, the righteous for the unrighteous, to bring you to God. He was put to death in the body but made alive in the Spirit. 19 After being made alive,[a] he went and made proclamation to the imprisoned spirits— 20 to those who were disobedient long ago when God waited patiently in the days of Noah while the ark was being built. In it only a few people, eight in all, were saved through water,

Revelation 1:17-18New International Version (NIV)

17 When I saw him, I fell at his feet as though dead. Then he placed his right hand on me and said: “Do not be afraid. I am the First and the Last. 18 I am the Living One; I was dead, and now look, I am alive for ever and ever! And I hold the keys of death and Hades.

Looking at Matt 12:40 and Eph 4:7-9, they analyze that Jesus therefore spent 3 days in Hades.  Along this line, Jehovah’s Witnesses and 7th Day Adventists deduce Michael the Archangel is Jesus based on the following:

1 Thessalonians 4:16-17King James Version (KJV)

16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

This verse did not state the archangel descended.  Logical question: If I represent a group of concerned citizens at a gathering, am I the concerned citizens?  Nor did those other verses directly state Hades was the lower parts of the earth.

The same logic that Jehovah’s Witnesses and 7th Day Adventists use to claim Jesus is an angel by the use of Rev 20:1-2 and comparing 1 Peter 3:18-20 and Rev 1:17-18.  This can simply be disputed with Heb 1:5-6 & 13 that He is not an angel. Realize this is a tangent.

Revelation 20:1-2King James Version (KJV)

20 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand. And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,     

So why couldn’t Jesus hand the keys to an angel (such as Michael) and then lock up Satan?

What Hades or Hell is, is another subject. Many articles seem to indicate that Sheol/Hades is multi-level.  The top would contain the righteous dead, the 2nd level would be the not-so-righteous dead (some Catholics believe this is the so-called “purgatory” and use Luke 16:19-31 as a basis), the next level below that is “chains of darkness” in 2 Peter 2:1-4 and then the very bottom is the place where Satan is imprisoned (Rev 20:1-2).

https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/07/08/hell-hades-abyss-etc/

To effectively conclude that “Hades” or the common grave of mankind is in the depths of the earth, it requires detailed study.  It is the realm of the dead based on NIV.

A review of 2 Peter 2:1-4 would indicate those in Tartarus/”chains of darkness” are the false prophets.

Satan does not get imprisoned in the Abyss until Judgment Day (Rev 20:1).  So is Satan freely visiting Hades up until then? If Jesus does indeed have the keys to Hades, this is doubtful.

It would seem that Jesus would visit the righteous dead (including some of those that make up the 144,000) but why would He want to visit the unrighteous or wicked dead?  In conclusion the belief that Jesus descended to hell for 3 days is based on King James or Douay and research indicates that it was a long held belief of Catholicism.  Catholicism also believes that people go directly to hell or heaven if they are good or bad, and to “purgatory” if they need redemption. Is the “paradise” in Luke 23:40-43 in Hades or in the Holy City?  The latter is certain for those that have eternal life. The former could be the section of Hades where the righteous dead reside.

Psalm 119:25 indicates the soul clings to dust.  We know, based on Eccl 12:7 and Matt 27:50 that the spirit returns to God.  Unless one is cremated, the body remains in the funeral home for about a week to 10 days before the burial.  Jesus’ body was entombed for  3 days before resurrection.  So did the soul really cling to dust during that time frame? Eccl 9:5-6 states the dead know nothing (unaware of what is going on in the world).  What about a near-death experience?

So based on the evidence, it is quite possible Jesus did visit Hades or the realm of the dead but only in that section where the righteous dead or lost souls are.  To say He descended to hell for 3 days would be inaccurate given the vagueness of Douay and KJV.

(new development) – noticed a post where someone stated “Jesus lied in Matt 12:40 because He rose on the third morning”; is that true? Not. One needs to read the context around it. The following will refute that.

Matthew 12:39-40King James Version (KJV)

39 But he answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas: 40 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale’s belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

The verses cited were Matt 28:1-2, Mark 16:1-4, Luke 24:1-2 and John 20:1-2.  One needs to read them in context again.

Matthew 28:1-6King James Version (KJV)

28 In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre. And, behold, there was a great earthquake: for the angel of the Lord descended from heaven, and came and rolled back the stone from the door, and sat upon it. His countenance was like lightning, and his raiment white as snow: And for fear of him the keepers did shake, and became as dead men. And the angel answered and said unto the women, Fear not ye: for I know that ye seek Jesus, which was crucified. He is not here: for he is risen, as he said. Come, see the place where the Lord lay.

Mark 16:1-7King James Version (KJV)

16 And when the sabbath was past, Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James, and Salome, had bought sweet spices, that they might come and anoint him. And very early in the morning the first day of the week, they came unto the sepulchre at the rising of the sun. And they said among themselves, Who shall roll us away the stone from the door of the sepulchre? And when they looked, they saw that the stone was rolled away: for it was very great. And entering into the sepulchre, they saw a young man sitting on the right side, clothed in a long white garment; and they were affrighted. And he saith unto them, Be not affrighted: Ye seek Jesus of Nazareth, which was crucified: he is risen; he is not here: behold the place where they laid him. But go your way, tell his disciples and Peter that he goeth before you into Galilee: there shall ye see him, as he said unto you.

Luke 24:1-7King James Version (KJV)

24 Now upon the first day of the week, very early in the morning, they came unto the sepulchre, bringing the spices which they had prepared, and certain others with them. And they found the stone rolled away from the sepulchre. And they entered in, and found not the body of the Lord Jesus. And it came to pass, as they were much perplexed thereabout, behold, two men stood by them in shining garments: And as they were afraid, and bowed down their faces to the earth, they said unto them, Why seek ye the living among the dead? He is not here, but is risen: remember how he spake unto you when he was yet in Galilee, Saying, The Son of man must be delivered into the hands of sinful men, and be crucified, and the third day rise again.

John 20:1-2King James Version (KJV)

20 The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre. Then she runneth, and cometh to Simon Peter, and to the other disciple, whom Jesus loved, and saith unto them, They have taken away the Lord out of the sepulchre, and we know not where they have laid him.

Jesus stated that his 3 days and 3 nights in the earth are a sign of the prophet Jonas in Matt 12:39.  The word “shall” is a prediction.  If one looks at the other verses, the angel of the Lord is the one who opened the stone door on the tomb.  Also, reviewing Matt 24:36 about Him not knowing the hour of His coming (in regards to Judgment Day), why could that not be applied to this situation? It is true He was resurrected on the third day and it would indicate He had no control as to time of day and claim “Jesus lied” is erroneous.  Given that He also stated in John 10:29 and Matt 14:28 that the Father is greater, this would indicate that – in logical terms, the brain has control over the body.

Jesus KNEW of the 3 days as written below:

Luke 24:46-47New International Version (NIV)

46 He told them, “This is what is written: The Messiah will suffer and rise from the dead on the third day, 47 and repentance for the forgiveness of sins will be preached in his name to all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Pre-Trib or Post Trib Rapture? Or Mid-Trib?

 

This particular writer believes that the “rapture” (1 Thess 4:16-17) is the same as the first resurrection.  Eph 5:27 says the church shall be without spot and blameless.  Elders and overseers have to be blameless. This subject requires intense study because there are no specific verses that say the “rapture” occurs before or after the Great Tribulation. Most practicing Christians believe in a post-Trib “rapture.”

http://www.warsofgod.com/01_firstresurrection.html this article supports a post trib “rapture”

The below video supports a post trib rapture – the only thing is the presenter does not believe in the 7 year tribulation.

What would be strong evidence toward a post Trib “rapture”

  1. The current world situation appears to indicate that we are at the tail end of the 7 year Tribulation period.  Recent news articles or internet posts indicate a massive buildup of troops near Russia along with attempts to disrupt the Trump inauguration on Jan 20.
  2. Revelation 7:14-17King James Version (KJV)14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. 15 Therefore are they before the throne of God, and serve him day and night in his temple: and he that sitteth on the throne shall dwell among them. 16 They shall hunger no more, neither thirst any more; neither shall the sun light on them, nor any heat. 17 For the Lamb which is in the midst of the throne shall feed them, and shall lead them unto living fountains of waters: and God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes.
  3. Revelation 20:4-6King James Version (KJV)And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years. But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Titus 1:6-7New International Version (NIV) An elder must be blameless, faithful to his wife, a man whose children believe[a] and are not open to the charge of being wild and disobedient. Since an overseer manages God’s household, he must be blameless—not overbearing, not quick-tempered, not given to drunkenness, not violent, not pursuing dishonest gain.

http://www.warsofgod.com/03_satan_in_heaven.html this seems to indicate that Satan is thrown down halfway during the 7 year tribulation to wage war on earth.  Given the state of current events since about 2009-2010, including an increase in lawlessness in the past 3 1/2 years or so, this article would quite possibly be logical. The other signs that make this a viable idea in a church are allowing things that were forbidden, twisting of the scriptures that were used for pristine teachings but now promote something that could be deemed evil, turning into a commercial endeavor (like all of a sudden owning for profit business), etc.  The Illuminati could or have been infiltrating what were pristine churches.  Civil right of Christians seem to have been eroding since about 2012-2013.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rapture this is an article with the reasoning and belief.

Some that believe in a post Trib rapture also believe the Millenial Kingdom is in heaven and the earth is laid bare after Armageddon.  There is no confirmation or denial that there are survivors of God’s wrath.

If a pre-Trib or mid-Trib rapture were to occur, would earthly Christian professing organizations remain?  The third article seems to infer that Jesus comes silently for the church and then publicly with the church the 2nd coming in the case of these two (Matt 24:36 indicates Jesus doesn’t know the hour of His coming and making an invisible appearance would seem to go against this verse).  A pre or mid trib “rapture” would be too many complications and questions to be begged.

  1. Assume that all true Christians, dead or alive, are raptured.  What happens to those that come to Christ during the 7 year tribulation?  (note: this time period is not really crystal clear). http://www.truthortradition.com/articles/23-reasons-to-believe-in-a-rapture-before-the-great-tribulation seems to be a pretty extensive reasoning.
    1. In this article, it points out that those that survive the Great Tribulation are in Christ’s Millenial Kingdom on earth. However, Rev 7:15-17 line up with entrance into the Holy City described in Rev 21:1-4.
    2. http://www.thepropheticyears.com/reasons/rapture.htm this article seems to state that all “practicing Christian” religions will go through the tribulation. This would line up with fall of Babylon occurring just after the Great Tribulation. Again, the current world situation seems to indicate that the Tribulation may be in progress or at least be midway through.
      1. Does that mean there are really no true Christians on earth that are alive? Doubtful but they are or will be tested.  Zechariah 13:9 is refining the third part through the fire.Zechariah 13:9King James Version (KJV)And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The Lord is my God.
      2. Given that the “alive in Christ meet in the clouds,” there have been no accounts of people vanishing into thin air. One argument against a pre-Trib rapture.
    3. The common thing is that the pre-Trib believers profess there is a difference between the “rapture” and the “first resurrection” and they also believe the millennial kingdom is on earth (those that profess a post-Trib rapture often believe the millennial kingdom is in heaven).
      1. Rev 20:4-6 defines the first resurrection.  This line of thought would indicate the resurrected dead join the survivors of the Great Tribulation. The issue is that people have been slain in the name of Christ for nearly 2000 years and continue to be.
      2. They say that there would be no time to separate the sheep and the goats as written in Matt 25:32-41.  This verse indicates judgment day and lines up with Rev 20:12.
    4. The possibility of  a mid-Trib rapture is more likely given the current world situation. Examination:
      1. The Tribulation could have possibly started in Jan 2013 and the midpoint (the start of the 1360 days) is quite possible in the summer of 2016.
        1. Erosion of rights of Christians and Jews.  Prior to this, there was no complaining about celebration of Christmas (some non-Trinitarians don’t celebrate it but they never went to court to have it removed and Jews never complained either) or Hanukkah and some complained and managed to have them stopped.  The generic “happy holidays” is politically correct.
        2. Right wing Christians have been sued for not catering to LGBT.  The problem is this is a double standard because if a Muslim refuses to cater to LGBT, nothing is done.
        3. It is OK to talk about killing police and to glorify the street gang way of life but it is considered an outrage to pray in public.
        4. The tail end of the hour of judgment appears to have been started at that time with the Jehovah’s Witnesses being exposed for not reporting child molestation to the authorities (In California, a total of $42 million in damages have been awarded to date for victims abused as youth; in 2016, the Australian Commission investigated 1006 cases not reported since 1955 and they will reconvene in March 2017).  In the past two years, some other non-Trinitarian religions have had some internal conflict that has been made public to a limited audience.  Finally, there is an expose of the abuses of the Church of Scientology that has been public since the end of 2016 (although not Christian, there are some striking similarities of these abuses vs some professing Christian organizations).
        5. The midpoint – shift to conservative governments.
          1. Rodrigo Duterte was elected President of the Philippines in May 2016 and swore in during the summer.  There was an aggressive campaign of eliminating drug lords and prosecuting pushers and users (there were some killings by the government but also the criminal element and vigilantes used this as an excuse to silence witnesses) and exposing police and government offiicials who cater to them. He denounced Obama and the current government and professed allegiance to Putin and China and Trump.
          2. Vladimir Putin appears has a tough stance on radical Islam.
          3. Donald Trump was elected President of the United States and will have a Republican dominated Congress.
          4. Some European governments have withdrawn from the European Union.  Great Britain and France appear to support Trump.
          5. The conservative governments appear to want to avert World War 3 and some outgoing liberal governments apparent want to start it since they are owned by the elite (who make money off wars and bankrupt governments).
        6. In the Wikipedia article, evidently Satan and his angels are thrown out of heaven at the point where the 1360 day period starts.  This involves an infiltration of religions in an effort to corrupt or apostatize.  Also people who are leaving churches and pursuing more worldly things.  This is a last ditch effort to prevent the church from being cleaned up.  The churches that are not of God will go about their ways and not change, and people will be plucked out of them.  Those that are truly of God will heed to the signs and warnings and will clean up their acts.   In the first case, those who are expelled or choose to disassociate will do so because they realize their organization is corrupt and goes against their moral standards or the bible; consequently, they will seek a church that adheres more closely to the bible.  In the second case, the truly wicked will be expelled or leave on their own.
          1. After this cleanup, the true Christians will rise to heaven as written in 1 Thess 4:16-17 to be spared the Tribulation.  The churches that are true to God could possibly cease to exist on earth.  Christian-professing organizations will still remain on earth but their members will undergo tribulation.  It is also possible at this time that the remaining organizations will unite as the “one world religion” and anyone who enters it will receive the mark of the beast.
          2. The bible specifically says “children of tribes of Israel” are part of the 144,000 in Rev 7:2-5.
          3. During the last half of the Tribulation, there will be those that will continue to be “beheaded in the name of Jesus” (as written in Rev 20:4-5).  At the end of the Tribulation, all those “beheaded” will be resurrected with the survivors of the Great Tribulation and enter the Holy City.  This has to happen before God’s wrath where Babylon falls and the current earth is laid bare. It is also quite clear that the second death has no power over those in the first resurrection.
    5. Pre-Trib or Mid-Trib still raises questions whether the first resurrection occurs in two parts or not.

The church would have to be pure before the “rapture” in all cases (Eph 5:27). The “hour of judgment” in Rev 14:7 is exposing misdeeds of various religious leaders and cleaning the church in general.  The actions are previously mentioned under “Mid-Trib Rapture.”  Titus 1:6-7 states “elders and overseers will be blameless.”  The bible says to expel the wicked and that means both leaders and members alike. Also, not all churches are perfect so sometimes it makes better sense to remain and attend worship but pay attention to detail on what is being taught from the pulpit.

1 Corinthians 5:11-13New International Version (NIV)

11 But now I am writing to you that you must not associate with anyone who claims to be a brother or sister[a] but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or slanderer, a drunkard or swindler. Do not even eat with such people. 12 What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside? 13 God will judge those outside. “Expel the wicked person from among you.”[

Jesus does come down to earth after the Great Tribulation.  History and the bible seem to favor a post-Trib.   The wrath of God commences at the end of the Great Tribulation according to various timelines.  It is biblically clear that the survivors of the Great Tribulation experience no more pain and sorrow and enter the Holy City.  It is also biblically clear that those “beheaded in the name of Christ” are the first resurrection and reign with Christ 1000 years and that the 2nd death has no power.  It is also clear in Rev 14:3 that the 144,000 are already in heaven BEFORE the fall of Babylon in Rev 14:8. Rev 14:12-20 indicates that there may be more coming to Christ during the millennium and the last verse coincides with the consuming by fire of those outside God’s camp at the end of the millennium (Rev 20:8-9).

The 1000 year period: https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/06/23/the-1000-year-period/

More updates…..

 

 

The Seven Seals of Revelation

Is it possible they are not chronological? This is under constant revision.  What is happening at this point in time is the 144K are still being sealed.  Those being beheaded in Jesus’ name (Rev 20:4-5) has been an ongoing thing.  The Great Tribulation has not happened yet.

Rev 6 and 8 describe them. For clarity, I have separated them.

Revelation 6King James Version (KJV)

And I saw when the Lamb opened one of the seals, and I heard, as it were the noise of thunder, one of the four beasts saying, Come and see. And I saw, and behold a white horse: and he that sat on him had a bow; and a crown was given unto him: and he went forth conquering, and to conquer.

And when he had opened the second seal, I heard the second beast say, Come and see. And there went out another horse that was red: and power was given to him that sat thereon to take peace from the earth, and that they should kill one another: and there was given unto him a great sword.

And when he had opened the third seal, I heard the third beast say, Come and see. And I beheld, and lo a black horse; and he that sat on him had a pair of balances in his hand. And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts say, A measure of wheat for a penny, and three measures of barley for a penny; and see thou hurt not the oil and the wine.

And when he had opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth beast say, Come and see. And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth.

And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held: 10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth? 11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; 13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind. 14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places. 15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains; 16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: 17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

Revelation 8:1King James Version (KJV)

And when he had opened the seventh seal, there was silence in heaven about the space of half an hour.

The timeline of Judgment Day is contained in 2 Peter 3:7-13. Verses 7-12 relate to the destruction of the current earth.  Verse 13 is the new heaven and new earth and related is the Holy City coming down from heaven in Rev 21:4

The below describes the last 3 1/2 years of the 7 year tribulation:

Daniel 12King James Version (KJV) And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book. And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever. But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased. Then I Daniel looked, and, behold, there stood other two, the one on this side of the bank of the river, and the other on that side of the bank of the river. And one said to the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, How long shall it be to the end of these wonders? And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished. And I heard, but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what shall be the end of these things? And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end. 10 Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand. 11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days. 12 Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days. 13 But go thou thy way till the end be: for thou shalt rest, and stand in thy lot at the end of the days. 

1 Thess 4:16-17 is the first resurrection.  Rev 20:4-6 defines part of the dead in Christ.  Rev 7:14-17 defines the survivors of the Great Tribulation who would be the “alive that meet the Lord in the clouds”

Rev 20:7-10 is the release of Satan at the end of the millennium, the consumption by fire of the deceived and his being tossed in the lake of fire.

Rev 20:12-15 is the final judgment.

Revelation 4:7King James Version (KJV) And the first beast was like a lion, and the second beast like a calf, and the third beast had a face as a man, and the fourth beast was like a flying eagle. 

The seven seals will be analyzed from simplest to most difficult.

The seventh seal could quite possibly be fulfilled by the interval from the end of World War 1 to the start of World War 2. It also makes sense because of the tragedies forthcoming in the third through 6th seals as described in the remainder of Rev 8. Matt 24:6 describes wars and rumors of wars.  Matt 24:21 is the Great Tribulation. The mathematical basis:

2 Peter 3:8King James Version (KJV)

But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

1000/24 = 41.667 years or 41 years and 8 months.  Half hour = 20.833 years or 20 years and 10 months.  November 11, 1918 was the end of WW1.  The start of WW2 was Sept 1, 1939.  20 years and 10 months would have been Sept 11, 1919 so the difference was 10 days.  That is an accuracy of .14 percent.

Some believe the seventh seal is actually the final destruction of earth.

The first and second seal and the beasts can be clarified in Rev 13.  In Rev 4:7 the first beast is described as likened to a lion and the second beast has been described as likened to a calf. 

Daniel 7:5King James Version (KJV) And behold another beast, a second, like to a bear, and it raised up itself on one side, and it had three ribs in the mouth of it between the teeth of it: and they said thus unto it, Arise, devour much flesh.

https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/06/20/the-mark-of-the-beast/

 The summary of the above link is the first beast is the system that has been in place for 5000 years.   The second beast is two super powers that control the governments, the banking system, the music industry and quite possibly the religious leaders. The rise and fall of communism (the Bear) in eastern Europe commenced in 1918 with Lenin and its fall was 1989. 

Another article found on Facebook seems to indicate the first beast is a religious deception.  The Roman Catholic Church could be a distinct possibility, considering the events of the 4th century and that a number of restorationist and even “born again” seem to believe in an apostacy of the first century church of Christ.

The second seal describes the red horse as possibly being Satan wreaking anarchy on the earth.  This is coincident with the mark of the beast.

Revelation 13King James Version (KJV)

13 And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy. And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority. And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast. And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him? And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months. And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven. And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations. And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. If any man have an ear, let him hear. 10 He that leadeth into captivity shall go into captivity: he that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints. 11 And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon. 12 And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed. 13 And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men, 14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live. 15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed. 16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads: 17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name. 18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.

The white horse described in the first seal is described as follows:

Revelation 19:11-14King James Version (KJV) 11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war. 12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself. 13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God. 14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.

The red horse most likely contains Satan.  This would describe the anarchy currently happening and the events that preclude it.  The Federal Reserve was established in 1913 and the United Nations 1945.  The second beast describes the UN and the Federal Reserve. The world chain of events and atrocities seem to line up.  The rise of communism in 1917 (and diminishing at the end of the 20th century), 6 million Jews being slaughtered in German concentration camps, the amount of riots and protests in the 1960s, the treatment of prisoners of war in Vietnam, 9/11 (which has really triggered the current situation) and what has happened since seem to confirm. Since World War II, the world has been at war in various places.

This is also coincident with the Facebook article.

The third seal:

  1.  The only other place besides Rev 6 where the black horse is described is Zechariah 6: 2-6King James Version (KJV)In the first chariot were red horses; and in the second chariot black horses; And in the third chariot white horses; and in the fourth chariot grisled and bay horses. Then I answered and said unto the angel that talked with me, What are these, my lord? And the angel answered and said unto me, These are the four spirits of the heavens, which go forth from standing before the Lord of all the earth. The black horses which are therein go forth into the north country; and the white go forth after them; and the grisled go forth toward the south country. 
  2. The third beast described in Rev 4:7 has the face of a man. A review of Daniel 7 would seem that the Pope is the third beast.  Articles seem to indicate it is Greece.  After all, the Catholic Church split into Greek Orthodoxy and Roman Catholicism.
  3. The rich get richer and the poor get poorer. The poor would be affected by famine but it would not have any effect on the rich. If one thinks about it, a group of billionaires control the world (George Soros on the far left, the Koch brothers on the right, the Rothschilds overall, Mark Zuckenberg became a billionaire because of Facebook, Bill Gates, Warren Buffett, and the list goes on and on).

The Facebook article may also indicate the Great Depression as part of this too.

The fourth seal:

  1. 1/4 of the world’s population is killed by war and famine, along with the beast.  It could describe the fall of Babylon and destruction of those with the mark of the beast.Daniel 7:7King James Version (KJV) After this I saw in the night visions, and behold a fourth beast, dreadful and terrible, and strong exceedingly; and it had great iron teeth: it devoured and brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with the feet of it: and it was diverse from all the beasts that were before it; and it had ten horns. 
  2. In Rev 4:7 the fourth beast is likened to a flying eagle.
  3. This would be those that die in sin.
  4. Some theorize that Rev 6:8 could apply to World War 1 because it was fought over 1/4 of the earth’s surface.

The fifth seal is the first resurrection. That is accurately described.

If one reads Rev 19:1-2 it indicates that the the fifth seal could possibly happen before or at least at the same time as the fourth, given that the chosen are resurrected before the major calamities

Revelation 19:1-2King James Version (KJV)

19 And after these things I heard a great voice of much people in heaven, saying, Alleluia; Salvation, and glory, and honour, and power, unto the Lord our God: For true and righteous are his judgments: for he hath judged the great whore, which did corrupt the earth with her fornication, and hath avenged the blood of his servants at her hand.

Verse 1 is the Great Crowd in heaven. and verse 2 would be the fall of Babylon. Verses 3-10 describe those that rise in the first resurrection and what they are doing in heaven.

The sixth seal is the great earthquake and the start of the wrath of God. Armageddon immediately precedes it.

Revelation 16:16-18King James Version (KJV)

16 And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon. 17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done. 18 And there were voices, and thunders, and lightnings; and there was a great earthquake, such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great.

The below describes what is quite possibly the final battle at the end of the millennium.  It makes sense because it is in close relation with Rev 20:7-10 where the beast and false prophets await Satan in the lake of fire.

Rev 19:11-18  describe Jesus coming down from heaven for the final battle.

Revelation 19:19-21King James Version (KJV) And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army. 20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone. 21 And the remnant were slain with the sword of him that sat upon the horse, which sword proceeded out of his mouth: and all the fowls were filled with their flesh.

Matthew 24:29King James Version (KJV)

29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

The fourth thru sixth seals are also consistent with the Facebook article.

 In summary…

What is locked in is that the fifth seal is the Rapture and the sixth seal is Judgment Day and God’s wrath.

The first seal was quite possibly opened when the system of things that controls the governments of the world, the financial system, the entertainment and media industry and even religious leaders, had started.

The second seal is possibly coincident with the establishment of the Federal Reserve and United Nations. The rise and decline of world Communism started in 1917 with Lenin.  USSR was recognized as a super power at the end of WW2.  The Cold War was a threat through the 1950s through 1991 with the Bay of Pigs/Cuban Missile Crisis bringing the world to the brink of nuclear war.  1991 was the demise of the USSR.  At this point, the Marxist-Leninist countries that remain are China, Vietnam, Laos, Cuba, North Korea. There are Communist elected officials in other countries.

The third seal appears to be the rise of the antichrist and false prophets. Also among this is famine.

The fourth seal apparently is related to World War III, the end of the Great Tribulation and the fall of Babylon.

Two possibilities exist for the 7th seal: the end of World War 1 (where the interval between it and the start of World War 2 is 10 days different than the calculated 20 years and 10 months) or the period before the final judgment.

Some proponents state the seals are in chronological order. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seven_seals shows different views.

One proponent states reverse order with the 7th seal being opened at the end of WW1.

For this writer, based on world events and numerous articles, the apparent order is 1-2-7-3-5-4-6. It makes mathematical and logical sense that the 7th seal would be opened at the end of WW1. Basically, since WW2, there have been numerous wars (Korean War, Vietnam War, Iran-Iraq, Desert Storm, Post 9-11 and the current conflict in Syria) along with a recent increase of natural disasters.   It appears that the “hour of judgment” (41 years and 8 months) is at its tail end given that numerous religious leaders have been exposed for misdeeds since the late 1970s; in short, organized religion is being given a chance to clean up its act.  The possible “one world religion” promoted by the Pope in 2015-2016, if materialized, would open the third seal given the third beast is described as a man (for that matter it could even be the President of the United States).  The reason I would tend to say the fourth seal would open after the fifth also could hinge on Matt 16:18 where the gates of Hades have no power over the church Christ built; those resurrected in  1 Thess 4:16-17 would be the church of Christ and be spared the final atrocities that happen just before Judgment Day starts (the fall of Babylon, destruction of 1/4 of the earth’s population with the casualties ending up in Hades to await the final judgment).  Two possibilities exist with the sixth seal: just after Christ’s second coming or the end of the millennium when the earth is destroyed (this is left open ended).

The 144 Thousand and the Angel from the East.

Who are they?

Where they come from?:

Revelation 7:2-6King James Version (KJV)

And I saw another angel ascending from the east, having the seal of the living God: and he cried with a loud voice to the four angels, to whom it was given to hurt the earth and the sea, Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads. And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel. Of the tribe of Juda were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Reuben were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Gad were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Aser were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Nephthalim were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Manasses were sealed twelve thousand.

Their qualities:

Revelation 14:1-5King James Version (KJV)

14 And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father’s name written in their foreheads. And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps: And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth. These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb. And in their mouth was found no guile: for they are without fault before the throne of God.

Who could be part of them (key word is maybe because some in the below would be outside the 144,000):

Revelation 20:4-6King James Version (KJV)

And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years. But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Revelation 7:14-17King James Version (KJV)

14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. 15 Therefore are they before the throne of God, and serve him day and night in his temple: and he that sitteth on the throne shall dwell among them. 16 They shall hunger no more, neither thirst any more; neither shall the sun light on them, nor any heat. 17 For the Lamb which is in the midst of the throne shall feed them, and shall lead them unto living fountains of waters: and God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes.

Would religious leaders or the “anointed” be part of it?

Matthew 5:8King James Version (KJV)

Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.

Acts 20:28American Standard Version (ASV)

28 Take heed unto yourselves, and to all the flock, in which the Holy Spirit hath made you [a]bishops, to feed the church of [b]the Lord which he [c]purchased with his own blood.

Romans 10:14-15New International Version (NIV)

14 How, then, can they call on the one they have not believed in? And how can they believe in the one of whom they have not heard? And how can they hear without someone preaching to them? 15 And how can anyone preach unless they are sent? As it is written: “How beautiful are the feet of those who bring good news!”[a]

So they have to be pure of heart and are appointed as overseers and “sent” (what defines this?) for openers.

Matthew 7:21-23New International Version (NIV)

21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ 23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’

2 John 7New International Version (NIV)

I say this because many deceivers, who do not acknowledge Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh, have gone out into the world. Any such person is the deceiver and the antichrist.

2 Corinthians 11:13New International Version (NIV)

13 For such people are false apostles, deceitful workers, masquerading as apostles of Christ.

1 Timothy 4:1-4New International Version (NIV)

The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons. Such teachings come through hypocritical liars, whose consciences have been seared as with a hot iron. They forbid people to marry and order them to abstain from certain foods, which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and who know the truth. For everything God created is good, and nothing is to be rejected if it is received with thanksgiving,

Revelation 22:18-19New International Version (NIV)

18 I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this scroll: If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to that person the plagues described in this scroll. 19 And if anyone takes words away from this scroll of prophecy, God will take away from that person any share in the tree of life and in the Holy City, which are described in this scroll.

They can’t be false prophets.  Making a blanket statement that one particular bible is true and the rest are of Satan is bogus (NWT or KJV).  Mind that men make mistakes both in preaching and bible translation.  Making money by using the name of God or commanding members of a church to commit crime, slander or hate is a false doctrine.

The Jehovah’s Witnesses believe only 144,000 are in the body of Christ and go to heaven.  They believe that Jesus only mediates them in 1 Tim 2:5.  This is what verse 6 says:

1 Timothy 2:6American Standard Version (ASV)

who gave himself a ransom for all; the testimony to be borne in its own times;

When one is asked if he or she is in the body of Christ (as per Eph 5:23 and Col 1:18), which we know is saved (John 10:9 and Acts 4:10-2) and the answer is “no,” that is denying Christ.

Who is the angel from the east in Rev 7:1-4 and was it present since the beginning of the gathering?  Remember that Revelation is a PROPHECY. Nostradamus predicted Hitler and JFK, for instance.

  1. Some say it is Cyrus (MSG and AMP Isaiah 46:11 specifically calls it out as the bird of prey). The time is 537BC.  Geographically, this is in the Middle East.  If you look at history, why would a tyrant be an “angel?”  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyrus_the_Great does also say he recognized the religions of the countries he conquered.  His rule extended from the Middle East to parts of Asia.
  2. Some say it is a specific person from the far east in the 20th century (using Isaiah 43:5-6, Isaiah 42:10, Isaiah 46:11 most versions, and Matt 24:6-7 and 13).  It is an Asian country with a strong Christian influence and spread of the church is to the far west and going eastward.  The religion is worldwide. All this is consistent with God’s upcoming wrath.  WW1 is the first major war on earth.  There is a silence in heaven space of half hour (Rev 8:1) and that seems to coincide with the interval between the end of WW1 and start of WW2 (as mentioned earlier, it could be possible that the 7th seal is opened before the 3rd-6th written in Rev 6; initial examination indicates the first and second seals could have been open before WW1 – see the article “The Seven Seals of Revelation”); it indicates a calm before a series of tragic events.  One also has to admit there have been a number of wars (WW2, Korean, Vietnam, Desert Storm, the current campaign in the Middle East since 9/11/2001) and rumors of wars (since 1945, the nuclear threat; the Bay of Pigs in 1962 almost caused WW3 and the world being on the brink of it at this point).  There have also been an increase in the number of earthquakes, typhoons and hurricanes in the 21st century (Katrina, Superstorm Sandy, numerous earthquakes in Asia, and the recent New Orleans flooding) consistent with 2 Peter 3:6.  “There are so many preachers in the east that claim to be the vessel or the instrument of God in preaching the truth. One of them very much known in the Far East is a Korean by the name of Sun Myung Moon. Another is a Filipino by the name of Felix Manalo who teaches that he is the angel ascending in the east in the book of Revelation Chapter 7. Another still is a Filipino by the name of Salvador Payawal, who preached that the coming again of the Lord Jesus Christ on earth will be on January 1, 2001, 12:01 in the morning. And of course, in the Philippines, there is also Bro. Soriano.” (as claimed on a blog by a certain Elisio Soriano).
    1. A Wikipedia article about Unification Church and its “Divine Principle” states God combines masculinity and femininity, which is in direct conflict with the Bible since God is referred to as “He” and that woman came out of Adam’s rib.
    2. Felix Manalo registered the Iglesia Ni Cristo on July 27, 1914 and was originally Catholic.  He ultimately ended up as a 7th Day Adventist minister (and it was said he also studied with the Jehovah’s Witnesses) before losing interest in organized religion. Source: Wikipedia.
    3. Elisio Soriano is the chief evangelist of Members of Church of God International (aka Ang Dating Daan or “the Old Path”), formed in 1980 after he and 16 others broke from a church started by a dissident Iglesia Ni Cristo minister in approximately 1925.  Their reason for breaking off is the leader of the church was a woman.  Look up the Wikipedia article.
    4. What was stated about Salvador Paywal (“the coming again of the Lord Jesus Christ….. Jan 1, 2001”) contradicts Matt 24:36 and 2 Peter 3:7-13.
  3. Some say it is Jesus.  Heb 1:5-6 says that God does not allow an angel to sit beside Him.    Those that reject Apostle Paul may believe this and some Jehovah’s Witnesses believe it, although it is not specifically taught as part of their doctrine. They do believe Jesus made a silent return to earth in 1914. The main dispute is the bible verse. Also not enough substantial evidence.  Also verse 13 “But to which of the angels said he at any time, Sit on my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool?” By rejecting Apostle Paul, that leaves open that Michael is Jesus; however another article compares Jude 1:9 to Acts 20:28 ASV and Mark 16:19 (and they will try to say that NWT is the only true bible).
  4. http://www.goodnewspirit.com/michael.htm interesting article. Few teach this prophecy. This would indicate a future angel from the east and is a biblical interpretation. Also remember that Michael has been present since the beginning and is literally an angel.

All 4 of the above examples are in the eastern hemisphere. It cannot be a religious leader in the United States because that is the Western hemisphere.

Closer look at Rev 7:2 says “an angel from the east.”  This could indicate the possibility of more than one angel from the east including #1, #2, and #4; and #4 is a future.  If one takes Rev 7:4 and Rev 14:1-5 literally, it means the 144,000 are Jewish male virgins without fault; in short, “saints.”  Also, Eph 5:27 says the church shall be presented without spot and blameless.  The gathering of the 144,000 (or at least those beheaded in the name of Jesus as written in Rev 20:4-5) has been ongoing. The verses used to associate a man being an angel are in Rev 2: “angels of the church” refer to bishops.

Psalm 116:15New King James Version (NKJV)

15 Precious in the sight of the Lord
Is the death of His saints.

Psalm 16:3New King James Version (NKJV)

As for the saints who are on the earth,
“They are the excellent ones, in whom is all my delight.”

So saints can be both dead or alive.  This would give rise to 1 Thess 4:16-17.

Questions about the 144,000:

  1. When did they start gathering?  It would have to be somewhere around the time of the prophets.  The apostles would have to be part of it.  John the Baptist was beheaded in Matt 14:8 as a birthday present for the Pharaoh’s daughter (consistent with Rev 20:4-5). Persecution is part of the quality of being one of the group. #1, therefore makes sense in this case; however, Cyrus as a sole angel from the east would indicate that the 144,000 were gathered before Christ’s time.
  2. Are they still being gathered?  In the case of #2 and #4 in regards to the angel from the east, yes.
    1. Felix Manalo died in 1963.  The Iglesia Ni Cristo spread to the western hemisphere in 1968 and is in 101 countries with approximately 4 million members.  During World War 2, a number of Christians in the Philippines were slaughtered by Japanese soldiers, 6 million Jews and a small group of Jehovah’s Witnesses were exterminated in German concentration camps.  How many of these were worthy of sainthood? It is not impossible that some remnants of the 144,000 could be called during this timeframe (although the 144,000 are not taught in INC).
    2. Soriano proclaimed himself as such as in the quote. Self-proclamation is skeptical.
    3. Events after 1963 to present:
      1. Priests and ministers were jailed and even executed for their beliefs in Communist countries.
      2. Between 1967-1972, Jehovah’s Witnesses were beaten by police and citizens for refusing to obtain political cards.  Some were even murdered.
      3. Christians in the Middle East (including children) are being beheaded by ISIS.
      4. In the recent Marawi incident in the Philippines, there were reports of people being beheaded for refusing to convert to Islam.
    4. Michael the Archangel is a literal spirit being.  According to Revelation 12:7 he leads the battle of good and evil (“Armaggedon”) just before 2nd coming of Jesus; consequently, this would indicate a final gathering of the last remnants. One more thing of note is King Cyrus is mentioned in Daniel 10:1 as is Michael.
  3. Do they come from a specific religion?  Literally it would be Jews. Figuratively, Jews or descendents (including Christians).  Most modern preachers recognize that they are Jews (including some INC and MCGI).
  4. Would only that number be worthy of being in the first resurrection?  It is POSSIBLE given the stringent requirements. that is about 2 percent of the world population.
  5. Their purpose as defined in Rev 20:4-5 would be to rule with Christ for 1000 years.
  6. Are they the only ones going to heaven?  Not necessarily.  Rev 19:1

    19 After these things I heard[a] a loud voice of a great multitude in heaven, saying, “Alleluia! Salvation and glory and honor and power belong to the Lord[b] our God! This verse in Rev 19 is also related to the survivors of the Great Tribulation (Rev 7:9-13 is amplified by Rev 7:14-17).  

There is a chosen group:

1 Peter 2:9New King James Version (NKJV)

But you are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, His own special people, that you may proclaim the praises of Him who called you out of darkness into His marvelous light;

Deuteronomy 7:6New King James Version (NKJV)

“For you are a holy people to the Lord your God; the Lord your God has chosen you to be a people for Himself, a special treasure above all the peoples on the face of the earth.

Study the links in the “about” section.

So what do other do other religions say about an angel from the east?

Not a lot even preach it. It is a prophecy open to interpretation.  To prove it incorrect requires bible verses.

The Jehovah’s Witnesses believe that Jesus made a silent return to earth in 1914 to acquire the remnants of the 144,000.  This is based on the date of the siege of Jerusalem being 607 BCE (which is really the destruction of Assyria).  There are numerous sieges:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Jerusalem

Also keep in mind that Wikipedia is populated by users so check other sources.  There are some Jehovah’s Witnesses that believe Jesus is the angel from the east (although Watchtower does not formally teach it).

Final thought: given that there are the above beliefs that “an angel from the east” is a man, what about the possibility of it working through a man? This could settle the dispute.  Michael the Archangel leads the battle of good vs evil.  So why couldn’t he also guide a messenger? Daniel 10 seems to indicate the possibility based on Cyrus appearing in verse 1 and a mention of Michael in verse 13.  The events around Felix Manalo between 1914 thru 1963 (WW1, a number of martyrs in WW2) could also indicate the possibility.

 

Guaranteed Salvation and Doom

So who is guaranteed these two things?

Salvation:

One has to enter Christ to be saved.  John 10:9

Christ is the savior the body (Eph 5:23) the church (Col 1:18).

The gates of Hades (or hell) will not prevail.  Matt 16:18.

The pure of heart will see God (Matt 5:8)

He who believes and is baptized will be saved (Mark 16:16).  Rom 2:14-16 would apply to someone who did not have the opportunity (such as the thief on the cross, someone who is incarcerated or incapacitated, someone in a remote location) and that is a chance for salvation albeit at the white throne.

The 144,000 for certain (Rev 7:4-8 defines where they come from and Rev 14:1-5 defines their qualities).

Those beheaded in the name of Jesus (Rev 20:4-6) – can they be part of the 144,000? Figuratively it would include taking a stand and being put in prison or disciplined for your beliefs. Or giving your life for Christ.

The survivors of the Great Tribulation (Rev 7:14-17)

1 Thess 4:16-17 defines Rev 20:4-6 as part of the dead in Christ.  Rev 7:14-17 most likely defines “the alive that meet in the clouds”

Doom (before the final judgment):

Satan (Rev  20:10).  He is a spirit being who does not experience physical death.

Those with the mark of the beast (Rev 14:10-11). Based on the way the passage is worded and Luke 16:19-31, there is a possibility that they receive pre-Judgment torment in Hades (in the bad section) during the Millenium with the angels overseeing it (remember Satan is in the Abyss as written in Rev 20:1-3 and his angels are in the “chains of darkness” in 2 Peter 2:1-4).

The beast and false prophets (Rev 20:10, Rev 19:20). They are spirit beings who do not experience physical death.

https://messiahsbride.live/2016/11/10/fallen-angels/#_The_Abyss_and article about “fallen angels”

2 John 7King James Version (KJV)

For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

Besides this, it will include those that use God for their own personal gain (life of luxury and riches) and/or blatently sin while claiming to people of God (such as ordering violence on those that disagree with their beliefs, publicly shaming – Col 3:8).

Someone may unknowingly think they are teaching or following the words of God but not in accordance will face the final judgment.

Those consumed by fire (Rev 20:9)

Doom (during the final judgment):

Revelation 21:8King James Version (KJV)

But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

Matthew 6:15King James Version (KJV)

15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

Who is a murderer or liar?

1 John 3:15King James Version (KJV)

15 Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.

1 John 4:20King James Version (KJV)

20 If a man say, I love God, and hateth his brother, he is a liar: for he that loveth not his brother whom he hath seen, how can he love God whom he hath not seen?

If somebody’s religious leaders tell their followers to commit murder or other crimes to non-believers, then they are false.

Someone who THOUGHT he or she was preaching the words of God but ignored the signs of an unlikely messenger – Chick Tracts (www.chick.com) “Reverend Wonderful” and “Flight 144” are perfect examples of this.

Someone is going to inevitably ask why would a perfectly good non-Christian be doomed forever or, for that matter, one not in the so-called “true church?”  The verses are below.

Romans 2:13-16King James Version (KJV)

13 (For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified. 14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves: 15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;) 16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.

1 Corinthians 5:12-13New International Version (NIV)

12 What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside? 13 God will judge those outside. “Expel the wicked person from among you.”[a]

One key word is “wicked” as defined in verses 9-11. Ultimately the church is the first resurrection and the first sentence of verse 13 applies to those in the 2nd resurrection.  This verse is misused by some churches along with 2 John 1:10-11 to justify expulsion and shunning (if one reads verse 7 the ones you shun are those that do not acknowledge Jesus as coming in the flesh).

1 Corinthians 5:9-11New International Version (NIV)

I wrote to you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral people— 10 not at all meaning the people of this world who are immoral, or the greedy and swindlers, or idolaters. In that case you would have to leave this world. 11 But now I am writing to you that you must not associate with anyone who claims to be a brother or sister[a] but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or slanderer, a drunkard or swindler. Do not even eat with such people.

The above applies to those inside who remain wicked.  Hence some inside will be doomed and some outside might be saved.

2 John 7-11King James Version (KJV)

For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist. Look to yourselves, that we lose not those things which we have wrought, but that we receive a full reward. Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son. 10 If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed: 11 For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds.

If someone preaches door-to-door and presents a false doctrine, you shouldn’t accept them nor encourage them.  Questioning a religious leader because of a doctrine that violates the Bible is not a valid reason to shun someone.  If someone strays, our duty is to return the lost sheep to the fold as written below:

Luke 15:1-7King James Version (KJV)

15 Then drew near unto him all the publicans and sinners for to hear him. And the Pharisees and scribes murmured, saying, This man receiveth sinners, and eateth with them. And he spake this parable unto them, saying, What man of you, having an hundred sheep, if he lose one of them, doth not leave the ninety and nine in the wilderness, and go after that which is lost, until he find it? And when he hath found it, he layeth it on his shoulders, rejoicing. And when he cometh home, he calleth together his friends and neighbours, saying unto them, Rejoice with me; for I have found my sheep which was lost. I say unto you, that likewise joy shall be in heaven over one sinner that repenteth, more than over ninety and nine just persons, which need no repentance.

For instance, someone sins in a fit of anger and then is banned from his or her church.  Is that a reason to throw somebody away like a piece of paper?  Only God can judge and it is evident in Rom 2:1 that those who judge others do so according to their own sin.  Think about the alcoholic.  Deut 22:1-4 is about returning someone’s donkey but could easily apply to someone who has fallen.

Col 3:8 applies to hypocrites and fanatics – how can you claim to be a “Christian” if you slander or malign people who don’t agree with your belief system?

Colossians 3:8New International Version (NIV)

But now you must also rid yourselves of all such things as these: anger, rage, malice, slander, and filthy language from your lips.

The second key word is “opportunity.”

Along these lines, this is what the Bible has to say about hypocrites:

Mark 7:6-7King James Version (KJV)

He answered and said unto them, Well hath Esaias prophesied of you hypocrites, as it is written, This people honoureth me with their lips, but their heart is far from me. Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.

John 12:48King James Version (KJV)

48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.

Jesus and the Eunuch voluntarily went in the water (Matt 3:13-17 and Acts 8:37 respectively).  There are certain situations where baptism isn’t possible (being incarcerated or invalid, being in a remote location).

Hebrews 10:25 cites forsaking of the assembling of ourselves together.  Again, being invalid or in a remote location with no opportunity for assembling (even at sea on a ship you may encounter some with similar or the exact same beliefs).  Missionizing does happen in prisons, so that is an opportunity.  God understands that there are situations where one cannot assemble (such as military duty, lack of transportation or unavoidable schedule conflict); in that case you pray.  Repeatedly forsaking (such as blowing off assembling to play golf and not finding another time to worship) is rejecting the opportunity.

There are some places where Christianity is prohibited (such as China, North Korea, some countries in the former USSR, or countries in the Middle East/Africa) and worshipping carries the death penalty.  At this point, Christians in Middle East countries (including children) are being murdered by Islam extremists.  In former USSR countries, clergy were imprisoned for their beliefs.  So the question is are these people doomed because they don’t belong to a certain religion (there are countries where some religions are prohibited or no congregations exist)?  No.

Also under “opportunity” would include children and those with limited mental capacity.  In order to believe, one has to be able to understand.  Nor would they really understand what sin is.  So this group would not be doomed.

Summary:

Those guaranteed salvation are in the first resurrection.  Those guaranteed eternal torment are wicked (the beast, false prophets, those with the mark of the beast).  The millennium (if some survive God’s wrath) is a chance to come to God and being deceived will seal one’s fate.

There are a lot of good people in the world but they have flaws.  They are honest, treat others right, but there may be one thing or two that is not right. Some ask if a loving God would let them be tormented forever even for a minor sin.  Rev 20:12 says all men small and great shall stand before God and are judged according to their works.  Rev 20:15 says those not found in the book of life are cast in the lake of fire.

Part of the 144,000 are literal Jews (obviously not Christians).  As far as other non-Christians being saved, the two words “wicked” and “opportunity” apply and being judged according to one’s works; consequently, there is a chance (again read John 12:48).

What about atheists and agnostics?  Some would be classified under those with the mark of the beast since they sold themselves to Satan for fame and fortune; therefore they are considered wicked.  About 50 percent of the earth’s population believe in God or some Supreme Being.  What about an otherwise good person who doesn’t believe in God?  Was this person given the opportunity to come to God?  Did this person know any better?

https://www.gotquestions.org/sell-soul-devil.html But can someone really “sell his soul to Satan” (with no way of backing out)?

What about someone who led a decent way of life, behaved in a Christian manner, but had a weakness such as smoking marijuana or drinking alcohol?  Was this person given the opportunity to treat an addiction? Did they harm anyone? The below verses indicate excess and that can even include “being drunk with food.”

Ephesians 5:18New King James Version (NKJV)

18 And do not be drunk with wine, in which is dissipation; but be filled with the Spirit,

Isaiah 29:9New King James Version (NKJV)

Pause and wonder!
Blind yourselves and be blind!
They are drunk, but not with wine;
They stagger, but not with intoxicating drink.

The Biblical Unitarians have a moderate thought on this: OK to use marijuana or alcohol for medicinal purposes but not for the purpose of mind altering.  This is what the bible says about abstinence:

Acts 15:29New King James Version (NKJV)

29 that you abstain from things offered to idols, from blood, from things strangled, and from sexual immorality.[a] If you keep yourselves from these, you will do well.  (Leviticus 17:11-14 and 1 Tim 4:1-4 define “abstinence” as eating).

What about LGBT who basically live a good way of life and sometimes even attend worship services?  Some actually have better behavior than most so-called “Christians.”

When one gets to the point of the white throne, one’s life is reviewed in detail from beginning to end.  All the factors above are considered.  Humans are not perfect.  No need to reiterate the bottom line and that is whether or not one is in the book of life. Only God judges (remember Rom 2:1 in short “he who judges others does so according to his own sin”).

  1. In Rev 20:14, Death and Hades are cast in the lake of fire and it is the 2nd death.  These entities merely cease to exist.
  2. It may very well be that if someone makes it to the white throne judgment and gets thrown in the lake of fire it may be merely ceasing to exist.  If they are truly wicked then they may be subject to eternal torment (and this includes hypocrites).  Either way Rom 6:23 says the wages of sin are death.

Job 15:34-35New King James Version (NKJV)

34 For the company of hypocrites will be barren,
And fire will consume the tents of bribery.
35 They conceive trouble and bring forth futility;
Their womb prepares deceit.”

 

Conclusion

Based on Col 2:9 NIV, the entity consisting of God, Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit could be called the Deity. Or if you are a KJV-only enthusiast, the Godhead.  Some interpret this entity as a “Being” and some a “divine quality.”  If you read Col 2:9 in either KJV or NIV, it is also used as an adjective referring to the qualities (New World Translation calls it “divine quality” and Revised English Version calls it “what God is”).  This makes sense that Jesus proclaims the Father as True God (John 17:1-3, John 20:17), that the Father is greater than the Son (John 10:29, John 14:28), that the Father is a spirit (John 4:24) and not man (Hosea 11:9), that Jesus is a man in state of being (John 8:40, Luke 24:39, 1 Tim 2:5) and divine (John 1:1 REV and Moffatt) and the Son of God (John 20:31) ,and that the Holy Spirit is sent by God and Jesus (1 Peter 1:12 being among the verses) and teaches (Luke 12:12, 1 Cor 2:13) and appoints bishops/overseers (Acts 20:28) . 1 John 5:7 King James Version (KJV)  For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one (Jesus also said in John 10:30 I and my Father are one and it could refer to unity; as read previously, NIV and some others omit the part after “heaven” in 1 John 5:7).  Food for thought: 1 John 5:7 did not say one Being. The Trinitarian doctrine, like it or not, was created in 325 AD (declared an article of faith that Jesus was God) and 381 AD (declared an article of faith that the Holy Spirit was also God).  Whether or not your belief is Unitarian, Armstrongist, Trinitarian, Apostolic Oneness or hierarchical Godhead is biblical interpretation; the problem is each one of the belief systems states the remainder will burn in the lake of fire and they support the systems with verse. 

The name of God is YHWH in the Old Testament and it appears 5822 times.  In the Revised English Version it is called Yahweh.  American Standard calls it Jehovah (the common English name was coined by a Catholic monk named Raymundus Martini in 1278 AD by combining YHWH and the vowels of Adonai and Elohim).  Jesus calls Him Father (John 17:1-3, John 20:17 and Matt 6:9).  The Almighty calls Himself God in Hosea 11:9.  There are some that say if you don’t address Him as Jehovah you are doomed and some say that this address is blasphemy.  You can’t go wrong by addressing Him as Father or by title Lord God.

Jesus existed in the beginning as the Word (John 1:1; some believe it is God’s thought) and it can be deduced, based on Eccl 12:7 and Matt 27:50, that the spirit exists with God; Christian Churches of God (www.ccg.org), a form of Biblical Unitarianism believes Jesus pre existed in spirit form.  Jesus Himself even stated in John 17:5 that His glory existed with God before the world was. God’s plan John 3:16 was manifested in Matt 1:18 and Gal 4:4-5.  Jesus’ state of being from birth through resurrection was flesh and bone (Heb 13:8)  with no blood (John 20:27), transformed from an earthly body to glorious (Phil 3:20-21 and those who have eternal life will have it); this does not contradict 1 cor 15:50 (and verses 50-58 describe our transformation from a mortal body to one worthy of the kingdom of heaven; it does not say we become spirit beings) .  1 Cor 8:6 says things come from God and through Jesus. He came from God and even said so (John 8:42) and does nothing of Himself (John 8:28).  God said let us make man in our own image (Genesis 1:26).  Heb 1:10-12 also indicates Jesus existed from the beginning. Colossians 1:15 New International Version (NIV) says  The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation.  He did not magically appear at birth like some extreme Unitarianism believes.  Even if one follows Phil 2:6-11, it would indicate Jesus was a spirit in the beginning, transformed to flesh and bone, and was resurrected and that God commanded He be worshipped.

To be saved one must enter Christ (John 10:9).  Christ is the head of the body, the church (Matt 16:18, Eph 5:23, Col 1:18).  It is called church of Christ (Rom 16:16, Acts 20:28 ASV and Lamsa).  Salvation is in no other name (Acts 4:10-12).  He is Lord (Acts 20:28 ASV, Mark 16:19, Matt 17:4, Matt 20:30-33), worshipped (Heb 1:6, Matt 28:9, Rev 5:13-14).   Nobody comes to the Father except through Him (John 14:6, 1 Tim 2:5).  He tells us to forgive others (Matt 18:21-22, Matt 6:14-15).  He tells us how to pray (Matt 6:9-13). There are a number that claim to be the true church of Christ (even Catholicism) but do they pass the “church of Christ” checklist in another post?  What do you as a person have to do to be saved?  WHAT REALLY MATTERS IS ENTERING IN CHRIST.

The Salvation Timeline is 2 Peter 3:7-13.  The day of the Lord comes like a thief in the night and is 1000 years long.  Fire is reserved for ungodly men.  There is a new heaven and earth.  Rev 21:1-4 the Holy City comes down from heaven to the new Jerusalem and entrance is only for those in the book of life (Rev 21:27).  Jesus does not know the hour of His coming (Matt 24:36)

  1. The first resurrection is 1 Thess 4:16-17.  Rev 20:4-5 defines part of the dead in Christ.  Rev 7:14-17 defines the alive that meet in the clouds. Some religions believe in a pre-Tribulation rapture for the dead in Christ and post for those that survive it; the majority (both Trinitarian and non-Trinitarian) believe in a post-Tribulation rapture of both the dead and alive in Christ.
  2. The 2nd resurrection is 1000 years later (Rev 20:5-6).  Satan is imprisoned during the Millenium (Rev 20:1) and is released at the end to deceive (Rev 20:7).   Those that are deceived are consumed by fire (Rev 20:7-9).  The final judgment is Rev 20:12-15. Jesus even says in Matt 25:41 the goats are sent to everlasting fire reserved for the devil and his angels.
  3. Satan, the beast and the false prophets are tormented forever in the lake of fire (Rev 20:10) and those with the mark of the beast are tormented day and night with no rest and the smoke rises forever (Rev 14:10-11); furthermore, Rev 19:20 states the beast and false prophets are thrown alive into the lake of fire. This group is guaranteed eternal torment. Matter of fact, in Rev 20:10 the beast and false prophets are waiting for Satan.
    1. Here’s something to think about:  Satan is not thrown into the Abyss until Judgment Day (Rev 20:1).  It would appear the beast and false prophets are thrown into Tartarus (“chains of darkness”) along with Satan’s fallen angels (2 Peter 2:1-4) and that could possibly be Judgment Day.  They are demon spirit beings that do not die a physical death like humans do, so it would make sense that they are tormented forever since there would not be a second death.
    2. Those with the mark of the beast DO die a first death and, based on Luke 16:22-24, it is possible they would receive a pre-Judgment torment (most likely during the millennium) in that part of Hades overseen by God’s angels (read Rev 14:10-11 closely and one sees they are tormented in the presence of the Lamb and the angels).
    3. Here is an interesting blog about “fallen angels” – https://messiahsbride.live/2016/11/10/fallen-angels/#_The_Abyss_and
  4. Death and Hades are cast in the lake of fire (Rev 20:14) and that is the 2nd death; since these are not individuals, they are destroyed.  Those not found in the book of life are also cast in the lake of fire (Rev 20:15); whether or not they go “poof” only God knows.
  5. The gray area is the Millenium (1000 years between Christ’s 2nd coming and the final judgment).  One extreme is that some religions that originate from the 7DA believe that the 2nd resurrection is in Rev 20:8-9 and all are destroyed or sent to the lake of fire for eternal torment and that begs the question whether Rev 20:12-15 is chronological or in parallel.  The other extreme is only a certain group survive Armageddon and live forever on a paradise earth (only 144,000 go to heaven); for them, all others are destroyed at Armageddon (begs too many questions and would negate Rev 20:8-9 and possibly Rev 20:12-15).  The group in the middle (Armstrongism and Biblical Unitarianism) believes there is a paradise earth during the millennium but that eternal life is only after the final judgment in Rev 20:12-5; to them, people are still mortal during the time frame, Rev 20:7-10 and Rev 20:12-15 (which includes those alive during the millennium) can occur in sequence.  What really is the state of the earth during the Millenium and who, if any, will survive?  Only God knows but we don’t want to be left behind.
    1. One thought that has emerged, based on Rev 19:20, whether or not the earth is void of life , and that the lake of fire does not exist until the end of the millenium is that the 2nd resurrection can occur in 2 parts (and this coincides with 7DA teaching):
      1. The beast, the false prophets and those with the mark of the beast are those resurrected in Rev 20:8-9 and consumed by fire. They do not go to the Final Judgment.
      2. The remaining dead are resurrected in Rev 20:12-13 and are judged according to their works; this is the general resurrection.  This includes those that may be alive during the millennium not consumed by fire.  What would happen to a person who died before God’s wrath and was not exposed to Christianity?  Some will say “why would a perfectly good human burn in the lake of fire if he or she is not a Christian?” Only God knows this.
  6. So if we go on the assumption that there are some left in the Millenium, that is 3 chances for salvation: the first resurrection, redeeming oneself during the Millenium and not being deceived (sorry, if you are dead before Christ’s 2nd coming and aren’t in the first resurrection, you wait 1000 years and that’s written) or the final judgment.  Those that die during the Millenium will face the final judgment when resurrected but still have a chance.  If they are consumed by fire, then they are tormented for eternity or go poof (7DA teaching).
    1. Anyone that died before God’s wrath would have to wait 1000 years to be resurrected.
    2. The JW and Biblical Unitarians were taught of a paradise earth during that time and the Armstrongists were taught some would be resurrected for repentence.  Assume that some these people led a Christian life.  What they would be presented is a wasteland. Biblically, “paradise earth” would be possible at the end of the millennium AFTER the final judgment since the Holy City came down from heaven.
    3. It is quite possible those not exposed to Christianity in remote locations would be part of this group.
    4. Rev 14:12-20 indicates a possibility of survivors during the millennium.
  7. So how can one be given eternal life at the final Judgment? Rom 2:14-16 says we are judged according to the law.  1 Cor 5:12-13 What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside? 13 God will judge those outside. “Expel the wicked person from among you” (keep in mind that the previous verses apply to the truly evil who practice immorality, including those that claim to be brothers or sisters). Rev 20:12 says we are judged according to our works.  Not being exposed is one thing (such as where Christianity is forbidden by law or the person is incapacitated) but being offered the opportunity and rejecting is another (even prisoners are offered the opportunity because some religions are missionizing inside jails); the two opportunities that exist are before Christ’s 2nd coming and during the millennium (IF anyone survives; remember that only 8 humans and pairs of each animal survived the great flood at the time of Noah).  If you do not forgive others but maintain a so-called “Christian” lifestyle it is about certain you will not have eternal life (Matt 6:14-15); do not hold a grudge. 
  8. The bottom line is if you are part of the first resurrection the 2nd death has no power.  Otherwise you take your chances.  Do not be left behind!

Go investigate the links in the “about” section.  Attend bible studies and worship services.  Ask DIFFICULT questions.  Pray to God for guidance.

In regards to the Deity/Godhead mentioned in Paragraph 1:

1.Total Unitarianism (believing the three Beings are completely independent) makes no sense because Jesus said certain things (like He can do nothing of himself).  Let’s use the analogy of a Local Area Network and workstations.  The server is the controlling element and the workstations are connected via cables.  One can download files from the shared hard disk and the system has virus and malicious website scanning software for protection and control; the analogy is the Father has control of Jesus and the Holy Spirit, and Jesus also sends the Holy Spirt, plus there are no flaws (such as sin).  One could take his or her laptop workstation and connect it to the home router and it could be infected with viruses or malicious software; use this analogy on humans (who can be tempted by Satan). The other flaw is the Radical Unitarian belief that Jesus magically appeared at birth is erroneous based on Genesis 1:26.

2. Total Trinitarianism could be in error because Jesus SPECIFICALLY says “the Father is above all” in John 10:29 and that the Father is greater than He (John 14:28). The Trinitarian argument, of course, is Phil 2:6 King James Version (KJV)

Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:

Notice Jesus only THOUGHT; he did not say it specifically. Along this line, when Thomas said what he said in John 2o:28, Jesus did not confirm nor deny. Also in Matt 28:9 the apostles fell to Jesus’ feet and worshipped him.  Sometimes neither confirming nor denying is the correct choice.  Of course,  it was shown that Jesus existed in spirit form at the beginning based on Eccl 12:7, Matt 27:50, Gen 1:26, Heb 1:10-12.  There is not a word of “incarnation” in any of these.

3. Armstrongism believes God is a family consisting of Father and Son (Binitarianism) and the Holy Spirit is a force; however a force does not teach (Luke 12:12) or appoint (Acts 20:28).  The MCGI belief of God being 3 hierarchical Beings is half correct because of what Jesus said.  The Christian Churches of God is Unitarian but believes the Holy Spirit is a force; however, a force does not teach or appoint.  In both cases, assigning the name “God” as a noun to the entity called Deity/Godhead (which is biblical based on Col 2:9) is an interpretation; Jesus SPECIFICALLY said “I return to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God” in John 20:17. A reminder of specific assignment of names is contained in Isaiah 46:11 MSG that SPECIFICALLY calls out Cyrus as the bird of prey; the flaw with this bible is it is a paraphrase and most of the passages are not recognizable vs any other common bibles.

More specifically, even Jesus recognizes the Holy Spirit as a person/Being:

John 16:13-14New International Version (NIV)

13 But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all the truth. He will not speak on his own; he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come. 14 He will glorify me because it is from me that he will receive what he will make known to you.

4.  Apostolic/Pentecostal Oneness believes God is a spirit that manifests itself in the Father, Son and Holy Spirit.  The flaw is one spirit is not 3 separate Beings.

4. The analysis of the Deity/Godhead is contained in “The Divinity of Jesus” https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/08/12/the-divinity-of-jesus/ to avoid redundancy.  It could be an entity as opposed to a Being.  Christian Churches of God (www.ccg.org), a Unitarian organization, recognizes this and that Jesus originally existed in spirit form.

Remember, as in all the posts, this is live and constantly updated.  We are humans and not perfect and that is why we interpret the bible different. The worst thing a Christian can say is “you are wrong!” We should not be getting wrapped around the axle about the divinity of Jesus or whether or not God has a name.

A majority of practicing Christians believe the “rapture” (1 Thess 4:16-17) is post-Trib because of the simplicity.  Pre-Trib or mid-Trib is a bit complicated.  “Trib” is the 7 year Tribulation Period.

https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2017/01/15/pre-trib-or-post-trib-rapture/

The 1000 year period: https://religiousrealist.wordpress.com/2016/06/23/the-1000-year-period/

The bottom line: ultimately, the church of Christ is those in the first resurrection and are guaranteed salvation.  The first sentence of 1 Cor 5:13 states “God judges those outside”; some religions use this verse when reading names of expelled members but one needs to read the preceding verses (indicating the wicked are those with vices). Those with the mark of the beast, the Beast, the False Prophets and Satan and  are guaranteed doom.  The remainder have two outcomes: 1. Those not in the book of life are cast in the lake of fire.  2. Those found in the book of life are admitted to the Holy City and have eternal life.  IT’S YOUR CHOICE!

 

 

 

 

 

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